By Ray Stern
By New Times
By Amy Silverman
By Stephen Lemons
By Stephen Lemons
By Monica Alonzo
By Chris Parker
By New Times
LOST IN SPACE
A reformed Scientologist weighs in: Great article. I started Scientology in Phoenix in 1975. Wish you'd have done this article back then so I could have saved myself the large detour ("Pain in the Org," Ray Stern, October 13).
But the Scientology people who work in Phoenix were always nice by me. Dianne Koel and her husband, Les, were both at the Phoenix "org" when I went to it as a parishioner in 1975. Late in 1975, I [joined] the lifetime Scientology staffer religious order [called] Sea Org and spent 27 years in it.
I know and worked as a subordinate to both Linda and Tom Martiniano during their years in the upper echelons of the movement. Glad Tom is so candid about Scientology. Phoenix has several other even more senior ex-Scientology officials.
My thoughts are that official Scientology [should] just listen to these long-term, wise, independent Scientologists! Official Scientology ought to listen and learn something!
I'm a born-again atheist, so Scientology isn't my choice of activity. But I'm hopeful, like the excommunicated Phoenix staff member in the article who said he hopes the movement fixes itself and lets him rejoin. Further, I hope official Scientology reforms and lets all the independent Scientologists rejoin without any fuss — if the independents want!
Official Scientology has an intense organizational structure, all covered in detail by L. Ron Hubbard's staff-policy writings. It'd be nice to see official Scientology lower prices, stop harassment, and stop the nasty disconnections (excommunications).
Chuck Beatty, Pittsburgh
A "just cause" to Scientologists: Lunatic L. Ron Hubbard said, "Never fear to hurt another in a just cause" — and the brainwashed cult members consider their activities a "just cause," even if it means a breach of contract.
John Winter, Phoenix
Apparently, we are clueless and incorrect: If any other business or group had purchased this property, it would not have raised an eyebrow, and this article would not have been written.
Seems like New Slimes is going out of its way to malign a group of people for no reason other than a misguided attempt at "informing" on a subject they are clueless and incorrect about.
I feel sorry for the business owner in the story, but if this article is correct, it sounds like the previous owner was in foreclosure. [Scott Ruth] might have had to move regardless of whomever the new owners were.
John Gota, city unavailable
Take care when dealing with Scientologists: This guy [Scott Ruth] needs to be careful when dealing with Scientologists. There is a reason the group Anonymous protests them, as do many others.
Google the name "Operation Snow White." Under this official program, Scientology operatives committed infiltration and wiretapping. Also [Google] "Fair Game," the Scientology policy detailing how the organization may confront and handle critics and perceived enemies.
Vague ramifications for Scientology protesters: People who protested outside the Mesa Scientology center were followed by private investigators hired by the Scientologists. It got pretty bad for a couple of the protesters.
False pretenses abound: Scientology is science fiction — literally — based on a parlor trick that engages a basic human trait: the propensity of humans to cry, laugh, or feel nervous when presented with a stimulus such as the memory of a past event.
Whether the response (crying, laughing, or nervousness) is actual "healing" of that person's emotional pain from the past event or behavior is not proven by any scientific measure. While it yet may be proven, this response to stimuli is exploited by the originators of the group.
This group is based on false pretenses. Check out "re-evaluation co-counseling" on the web if you want a safer introduction to the same techniques used in Scientology. Some people find it a helpful counseling option.
A simple taxing solution: Just stop allowing tax deductions for contributions to religious organizations.
And while you are at it, stop giving people tax credits and deductions for having a dozen kids, often because their choice of religion [involves] some guy wearing a funny hat who doesn't think people should stick a condom on their dicks before having sex.
[And deny these credits to] the descendants of a flim-flam artist who started a cult so he could justify a dozen young women having sex with him.
In your article on Obama's war on weed (November 2nd, 2011) you wrote:With the country in economic tatters, no one has weed high on their radar.Except one group, say (Roger Salazar: "It's a mystery... where the pressure is coming from. My sense is it's coming from law enforcement."Is this guy really THAT naive, or is he just lying through his teeth. Law enforcement officers are ordered and pressured to make those raids. Those orders come from 'higher-ups', such as congress. And who are the ones hurt by legalized marijuana? The drug cartels. The obvious answer is that the drug cartels are pressuring those US congressmen whom they have given big bucks to, and consequentially, to have marijuana remain illegal. The answer is simple; find those congressmen and other politicians who keep it illegal, and boot them out.
Is this law Racist? Does it specify brown people?Are the people who agree with this law racist?Are those who want this law enforced racist?The law says nothing of little "brown" people but it explains what is illegal entry. It's not very hard to understand. Why is this law "broken"? Why can it be selectively ignored?Illegal alien includes all people who entered illegally, could be Croation, Russian, Chinese, Irish, Canadians and yes even Mexicans. No one single race or people is referenced in the law. Under Title 8 Section 1325 of the U.S. Code, "Improper Entry by Alien," any citizen of any country other than the United States who:Enters or attempts to enter the United States at any time or place other than as designated by immigration officers; or Eludes examination or inspection by immigration officers; or Attempts to enter or obtains entry to the United States by a willfully false or misleading representation or the willful concealment of a material fact; has committed a federal crime.Violations are punishable by criminal fines and imprisonment for up to six months. Repeat offenses can bring up to two years in prison. Additional civil fines may be imposed at the discretion of immigration judges, but civil fines do not negate the criminal sanctions or nature of the offense.These people cost Pheonix and surrounding cities hundreds of millions to support the education, health and welfare of these illegal immigrants. A landscape worker paid by cash (no taxes) and his wife (a stay at home mom), have been here for 16 years and had 7 children born in the US. Who do you think paid for her medical bills???Why isn't Obwama dealing with this
The future of L. Ron Hubbard's lunacy is in a fractured independence movement where lack of a paramilitary (Sea Org), espionage/Gestapo (Office of Special Affairs), pressurized sales and fund raising can render it relatively harmless. Getting there is going to be hard, because people get invested in the amount of money and time they've spent in what was designed by Hubbard as a trap to extract money. Some rich people gave $10 million dollars to this scam and they are PROUD of that.
Cult members are also on a power trip. They believe they "are the only ones who can save the planet" and that crazy Hubbard had "all the answers."
You can take the cult out of some Scientologists, but you can't take the crazy Hubbard out of 'em.
There is a Norwegian OT-VIII who finally came to the realization,"I am not a Scientologist" because he realized that while he found some of Hubbard's claptrap very helpful, even life changing, he just wants to be himself, and not tow the line of a truckload of history, quackery, misery and abuses. I hope more Scilons, independent or otherwise, can come to that realization.
The independent Scientologist still think that L Ron Hubbards Tech can help them. Dianetics can improve your life if you put it in day to day life. It's all bullshit and most independent Scientologist are still brainwashed and need help to get help. L Ron Hubbard was a crazy drug addict that has gave society nothing but a Bullshit scifi story and people are CRAZY enough to believe it.
Scientology is completely wrong. Zarzaga, Supreme Commander of the planet Xexapus, is the one true God. Now that that's settled, can we move on to more pressing issues?
@A reformed scientologist:
"Further, I hope official Scientology reforms and lets all the independent Scientologists rejoin without any fuss — if the independents want!"
What I like about the independent scientologists is they seem to have figured out that you don't need a church to do your own thing.
I'm an atheist too but I don't have a problem with religion so much as organised religions, aka churches. The problem with churches is that they imbued the pastors, priests, vicars with power over a group of people. That power can be and unfortunately frequently is abused. People can have a belief and do not need to support a church; all the propaganda that says otherwise was generated by churches.
Sure some churches do good things but churches are not the only organisations that do good things and secular organisations that do good things, such as the Red Cross, don't have the additional baggage of dogma that comes with churches.
The church of scientology is an extremely abusive organisation according to thousands of ex-scientologists whose individual stories reflect a definite pattern of abuse by the church of scientology collectively.
I don't agree with the independent scientologists that L Ron Hubbard gave the world scientology to help make a difference but that doesn't really matter. The fact they believe it means they will go on to try to use it to further their own ideological view of it as a benefit to society. The church of scientology mean while is, IMO, working as intended. It makes money, more money and more money, it uses people and spits them out and it tries to bulldoze anything that gets in its way.