Bill Montgomery Fails to Convict an Innocent Man

The most emotional day of Rafael Lavallade Gonzalez's recent weeklong trial in Maricopa County Superior Court occurred when Gonzalez took the stand in his own defense.

Thin and frail, with a lion's mane of white hair and dark-rimmed glasses, Gonzalez, a 70-year-old diabetic, stood charged with four counts related to forgery and using the identity of another for employment.

He was picked up with four others in August during an MCSO raid of a GNC warehouse at Buckeye Road and 63rd Avenue.

One of those arrested with Gonzalez was Luz Ruiz Rascon, mother of two children, one suffering from leukemia.

I discussed her case in my recent cover story, "Same as the Old Boss" (February 7), which details how Maricopa County Attorney Bill Montgomery has continued a policy of persecuting the undocumented begun under his disbarred and disgraced predecessor, Andy Thomas.

Rascon's charges are similar to Gonzalez's, and both have been in this country for decades. Each had worked at vitamin distributor GNC for about 11 years. Rascon packed and Gonzalez prepared cardboard boxes.

Both have been held non-bondable in Sheriff Joe Arpaio's gulags for more than six months, awaiting trial under the dictates of Prop 100.

Passed by the voters in 2006 during a nativist tidal wave that is only now showing signs of subsiding, this amendment to the Arizona Constitution added the undocumented to the ranks of pedophiles, rapists, and murderers denied bail.

Neither person is a flight risk. Neither has a criminal record of any kind.

But this doesn't matter. What matters is that supposedly there was "probable cause" to believe they were in the country illegally and that the "proof is evident or the presumption great" that they were guilty of a "serious felony offense," defined by the Arizona Legislature as a class-four felony or above.

The "proof" or "presumption," in the case of Gonzalez, was dead wrong. He was found not guilty of all charges after a grueling seven-day trial that exposed the hypocrisy and cruelty behind Montgomery's program of charging undocumented workers with the maximum, thus keeping them in jail and, often, coercing a plea out of them that makes them deportable from the United States.

Gonzalez refused to plead guilty. He is made of tougher stuff, evidenced by his testimony.

He talked of how he came to the United States in the '90s because there was no work for older men in Mexico.

"I knew I had to raise my family," he testified in Spanish. "I knew I had to feed my children."

He also knew the risk of going to another country, not knowing the language, but he had no choice.

"For my wife and my children, I would give my life," he said, his voice breaking.

In Phoenix, the sidewalks were paved with hot concrete, not gold. He looked for a job, but couldn't find one.

For five years, he sold paletas, Mexican popsicles, from a little, white pushcart on lease from a vendor.

Eventually, he saved enough money to get a truck and start selling ice cream. He had a valid Arizona driver's license, issued when the undocumented still could get them legally.

He knew a guy recruiting workers for GNC. He went in for an interview and was hired on the spot. He didn't dare ask how much GNC would pay him.

"My need was so great that I was not going to be picky," he said.

He did menial work at GNC. Work he was proud of, nonetheless.

He had reason to be proud. On a meager salary, he put a son and a daughter through college at Arizona State University, paying the out-of-state tuition rate demanded of undocumented kids by Arizona law, no matter how long they've resided here.

His daughter, Cecilia, graduated with a degree in business, his son Rafael, with a degree in mechanical engineering.

Both were on hand for every day of the trial, as were their mom, Gonzalez's wife, Maria, their priest, and dozens of family and friends.

Like many undocumented immigrants, Gonzalez had applied for and received a Tax Identification Number from the IRS.

With the help of an accountant, he paid taxes during the entire decade-plus that he worked for GNC, sometimes earning a refund when he paid too much. He has the tax returns to prove it.

Incapable of reading or speaking English, he seemed genuinely confused about the difference between a TIN and a Social Security number, which is needed to work in this country.

There was an SSN belonging to someone else on the documents in his personnel file, but he maintained that GNC instructed him how to fill out his documents, going line by line. And there were portions not in his handwriting written in ink of a different color.

Earlier, GNC's human resources director testified that she never helped employees fill out paperwork.

Still, Gonzalez's immigration attorney, Lance Wells, discovered that the Social Security number on one form was written atop a portion covered in correction fluid.

Held up to the light, Gonzalez's TIN could be seen written underneath. As Gonzalez had been charged with one count for every document in his file, prosecutor W. Tattnall Rush was forced to dismiss one count.

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88 comments
sahaptan
sahaptan

The problem here is the fact that illegal aliens are just that, ILLEGAL! What part of illegal don't the liberals, progressives and socialists of this nation understand? For every job that an ILLEGAL ALIEN takes, another American citizen and possibly even family man cannot find a job! If someone breaks into your house and steals your money, are they not a criminal? Consider the ILLEGAL ALIEN as that person and the STATE OF ARIZONA YOUR HOUSE ----- BECAUSE, YOU LIVE HERE! All of those illegal aliens are BREAKING THE LAW, THEY ARE STEALING FROM YOU AND THAT IS NOT ALL! Perhaps you need to be enlightened as to just how much damage ILLEGAL ALIENS CAUSE! CHILD MOLESTATION, RAPE, KIDNAPPING, PROSTITUTION, DRUG SMUGGLING, GANGS (like MS13), AUTO THEFT, BREAKING AND ENTERING, MURDER, ASSAULT and the list goes on! Don't think so . . . go to this site and see the facts for yourselves! THE ILLEGAL ALIEN INVASION IS NOT A VICTIMLESS CRIME!


http://www.usillegalaliens.com/impacts_of_illegal_immigration_crime_summary.html

ConcernedCitizenAZ
ConcernedCitizenAZ topcommenter

Mr. Lemons, Great journalism. Great public service keeping the harsh light of day on Arizona's justice system driven by the prosecutors / DA's / County Attorneys, who have absolute immunity, no oversight or accountability. How is this fair justice. Good to hear about an innocent man prevailing. He stuck to his guns and didn't get coerced into the usual plea bargain in a state that does "trials by plea bargain" which is NO trial or justice at all.


john04301
john04301

ice has released over 500 thousand suspected illegal immigrants pending their trial date who have (surprisingly) not shown up for their trial and are now fugitives from the law, these 500 thousand were arrested for being in the country illegally. that could be the reason behind the non bondable law we have in arizona. citizen children who use fake i.d to get into a bar or to buy cigerettes are noy going to be fugitives from the law.

serpico1000
serpico1000

Mr. Montgomery is the whipping boy of the Republican party in Arizona He is supposed to do as he is told, throw away the law rules and continue to do as you are told, if you are recalled, we will help you and cover up for you, the federal government can not do anything, we rule ourselves!!!

serpico1000
serpico1000

I'm sure, if this, or these cases happened in another country the U.S would be on top of them like stink on shit because that country was violating that person's human rights, should'nt there be an international law revising all of these attrocities and investigating? or nothing goes out of this country unless it is approved?

john04301
john04301

why is rascon brought back into the picture she knowingley use fake id to get a job she committed fraud and trying to be ingorant she expects to be set free. gonzalez was authorized to work he has a right to be free im not sure why he was using another's id or his application was tampered with but once the sitiuation was figured out he was released. mexicans and the lot are being targeted because they refuse to get right with the law their brethren are bring in drugs ,smuggling, trempling peoples property there are no positives to illegal immigration. if legalizing them would stop this then so be it but i doubt it

MaskedMagician1967
MaskedMagician1967 topcommenter

According to irs.gov, a TIN must be furnished on all tax documents.

Essentially meaning that this guy did absolutely nothing wrong.

LoopDeLoop
LoopDeLoop

QUOTE: "When I asked Montgomery for my cover story why he never prosecuted employers of illegal aliens under civil or criminal statutes, he insisted that no agency brought him those cases.

Yet, on the stand, Voeltz agreed that the MCSO works "hand-in-hand" with the County Attorney's Office when it comes to employees nabbed in Arpaio's raids." /QUOTE


Mr. Lemons, talking in circles is not valid journalism.  MCSO and the CAO working hand in hand does not mean that MCSO ever brought the CAO any cases against an employer, it really is pretty simple stuff.  

One must look at the real problems in these scenarios.  The real problems are, to put it simply, threefold- Illegal aliens continue to break our laws, the federal government does nothing about it, and corporations have more rights than persons through personhood.  Unfortunately, you cannot imprison a corporation or business entity, you cannot impose the same penalties that you can on a human- which is why businesses do not deserve to share the same rights as people.

On January 21, 2010, with its ruling in Citizens United v. Federal Election Commission, the Supreme Court ruled that corporations are persons, entitled by the U.S. Constitution to buy elections and run our government. Human beings are people; corporations are legal fictions.

We, the People of the United States of America, reject the U.S. Supreme Court's ruling in Citizens United and other related cases, and move to amend our Constitution to firmly establish that money is not speech, and that human beings, not corporations, are persons entitled to constitutional rights.

The Supreme Court is misguided in principle, and wrong on the law. In a democracy, the people rule.

We Move To Amend:

". . . corporations have no consciences, no beliefs, no feelings, no thoughts, no desires. Corporations help structure and facilitate the activities of human beings, to be sure, and their 'personhood' often serves as a useful legal fiction. But they are not themselves members of “We the People” by whom and for whom our Constitution was established."

            ~Supreme Court Justice Stevens, January 2010

biggs-wedge2
biggs-wedge2

If the company knew about their status...fine them big.

No matter how long they've been here or what "law abiding" lives they live here, send the illegal immigrants back to their home countries. No point in charging them with something. They most likely don't have a lot of money to pay fines, nor do we, Americans, need to pay for their cell time.

Send them home.

danzigsdaddy
danzigsdaddy topcommenter

they have the proof that the company was doctoring the paperwork, even if the guy was found guilty or innocent, the company had those forms in their office, not his. why is the company not charged with anything? 

ConcernedCitizenAZ
ConcernedCitizenAZ topcommenter

Mr. Lemons, Great article. Great public service keeping the harsh light of day on Arizona's justice system driven by the prosecutors / DA's / County Attorneys, who have absolute immunity, no oversight or accountability. How is this fair justice. Good to hear about an innocent man prevailing. He stuck to his guns and didn't get coerced into the usual plea bargain in a state that does "trials by plea bargain" which is NO trial or justice at all.

renkbooo
renkbooo

Dude seems to be talking a LOT of smack


www.Total-Anon.da.bz

IMakeLemmonade
IMakeLemmonade

Innocent?  Mr Lemmons, how is an i-l-l-e-g-a-l immigrant innocent of violating the law?  Once again, you never write about the people who come here legally do you, the one's who wish to become law abiding citizens not always taking shortcuts and screwing the taxpayers out of every penny possible. More than 600,000 people become citizens LEGALLY every year but you crackpot journalists and dreamers never speak about them.  By the way, that legal naturalization population, nearly 1:6 is from our neighbor, Mexico, and many  in general comes from Central and South America so all of you true racists or self haters need to wake up to the facts and look in the mirror and into your own hearts and live truth.

cinesimonj
cinesimonj

@john04301 Childish liar.

None of the trials have even started yet.

But sew the fear, little kiddie. Fear the brown people and their dastardly ways.

The fact that you are extremely dishonest in your representation, shows how little faith yu have in the extremist ideology you claim.

MotherJones
MotherJones

@john04301 Problem is, the law is supposed to be evenly applied. And it obviously is not. As for your stat, please cite the source.

IdontRecall
IdontRecall

John04301. I think that You need to go back to school, You know, learn how to write. If You check Your posts it's clear that You need to work on Your writting skills instead of spewing Your racist ignorant rantings. You need to get the facts before opening Your pie hole......classic ignorant trash talk. Can I say Jaffy's relative?. What a fng cesspool.

MotherJones
MotherJones

@john04301 because the county attorney is not addressing these cases on their merits, as individual cases. Instead, he hits them all as class 4 felony fraud. No matter what. 

biggs-wedge2
biggs-wedge2

Except of course entering this country illegally or staying in this country illegally.

End the trial; send him home.

MaskedMagician1967
MaskedMagician1967 topcommenter

@LoopDeLoop

Corporate personhood has been in existence since 1819.

I strongly disagree with Citizens United.

MotherJones
MotherJones

@LoopDeLoop "Unfortunately, you cannot imprison a corporation or business entity, you cannot impose the same penalties that you can on a human- which is why businesses do not deserve to share the same rights as people." 

Corporations most certainly can and are hit with criminal sanctions. Also, if someone knowingly takes a false ID, that's a crime. If there was a policy of taking false IDs at the company, the CEOowner cld be hit with criminal charges.

IdontRecall
IdontRecall

big-wedge, thing is if They ("Illegals") are sent home there are not gonna be any more unclaimed income tax returns, money that is used to support "Entitlements" as the Unemployment check that probably You get every week to support Your habits (possibly meth use, alcohol, etc) , then what are You going to do. BTW, probably They have more money than You do. EDUCATE YOURSELF. Do some research before openning Your pie hole.

bob_lablaw96
bob_lablaw96

@danzigsdaddy I think your question is the most important one to ask. Why are the employers getting a free ride on this?

Suppose that Joe White employed 10 illegals.  On payday, he has the Shurf do a raid. Does he have to pay for illegal work performed at his request?  What if his 10 illegals are in the gulags, and are deported? What did he do with the monies deducted from their pay for taxes, SS, Work Comp, etc?  Did he really pay those monies into the funds, or did he just deduct them from the pay of those that will be deported, and whose true identities may never be known?

Why doesn't Joke arrest the employers? That would end this issue so fast that Joe's hair would blow up like Donald Trump.

Itsthelaw
Itsthelaw

@IMakeLemmonade Uhm, you do realize that "illegal immigrant" is not a term recognized at law, right?  It's a phrase invested by the media and the radical right to make it seem like all these immigrants are criminals. The legal phrase is undocumented or unauthorized immigrant, and it is written that way, in the actual US Code, for a reason.

The simple truth is that very few have violated any criminal law in coming to the US.  Nearly all have violated a CIVIL law, much like you do every time you speed.

That's the law of the land.  Those wishing to comment on immigration should at least bother to learn its basic definitions.

MotherJones
MotherJones

@IMakeLemmonade hey doofus, did you read the story? the guy was found not guilty. and why do you haters never get pissed that the companies get off while the peons are chewed up and spit out?

john04301
john04301

a college kid (unless there is prior's or warrents) will not become a fugitive from the law for using a fake college I.D card.there wont be a trail he or she will go to  court and most  likely wind up paying  a fine and do community service , illegal immigrants have more to lose when they are captured, if during the investigation it is determind he or she is illegally in the country and falsified their authorization to work that is a felony not a misdearminor and a trail would be held unless the illegal waives . type in ice released 500 thousand suspected illegal immigrants then pick any site

john04301
john04301

you seem to have no problem understanding what i have writen if it hits a nerve to bad the reality is people like your ilk seem to think committing crimes for a better life is justifiable and thats sick s--t. i hope your i,d gets stolen and you have to spend years trying to get it corrected and whlie your doing that you can stcik your tunge up some illegal and have a field day you f"n bas-ard.

MaskedMagician1967
MaskedMagician1967 topcommenter

I hope he sues the county and wins a substantial settlement.

MotherJones
MotherJones

@biggs-wedge2 Too late. He won, didn't you read the piece? and ICE gave him bond. Likely he will be able to stay.

biggs-wedge2
biggs-wedge2

Mother, for once, I agree full-heartedly with you.

biggs-wedge2
biggs-wedge2

@IdontRecall Hmm, let me try and respond to this. As an educated person, a teacher at that, I'll try my best to make things clear.

You say that illegals pay taxes. I imagine some do. Some don't. This does not change the fact that they are illegal and shouldn't be here to begin with.

You seem to have a problem with entitlements, but I'll just touch on the unemployment that you spoke of. I have no problem with people collecting on unemployment for awhile, but the extended unemployment that the government gave (I think 2 years for some) is ridiculous. I was working in a warehouse after getting my college degree because I needed a job. Unemployment checks never even occurred to me.

You mention drugs and alcohol. Well, I do like me some Scotch. :)

You mention pie. I wouldn't mind some pie right now.

You make several assumptions. Sorry, but assumptions only make you an a$$.

john04301
john04301

if they are working unauthorized they are breaking the law its a felony by the way if they got the job using fake i.d or stolen i.d that to is a felony if they drive with out credentials that is a misedemeanor so if they are only here to work they are commiting criminal acts,  a citizen would be held accountable and would have to pay the consequences. we as a country cannot have 2 sets of rules for the sake of illegal immigrants

TryTryTryAgain
TryTryTryAgain

@ItsthelawIt is Illegal To Bring Illegal Aliens Into US under current Laws
It is unlawful for any person to bring aliens into the United States. Fine: $3,000 for each alien (Sec. 273. [8 U.S.C. 1323])


It is Illegal To Harbor Illegal Immigrants
. It is unlawful to bring in or harbor illegal aliens. Fine: $3,000 for each alien. (Sec. 273. [8 U.S.C. 1323] )


It is Illegal To Employ, Recruit, or Refer Illegal Aliens for Jobs
. It is unlawful for a person or other entity- to employ or recruit or refer for a fee an illegal alien in the United States. Commercial advantage or private financial gain offender can be fined under title 18, US code, imprisoned for not more than 10 years, or both. ...Any person who, during any 12-month period, knowingly hires for employment at least 10 individuals with actual knowledge that the individuals are aliens described in sub paragraph (B) shall be fined under title 18, United States Code, or imprisoned for not more than 5 years, or both. (Sec. 274A. [8 U.S.C. 1324a] )


It is Illegal To Forge Documents for Illegal Immigrants or violate Identity Theft Laws
. It is unlawful for any person or entity knowingly- to forge documents. Legal documents must be presented when entering the US.
( Sec. 274C. [8 U.S.C. 1324c] )
...Fine: not less than $250 and not more than $2,000 for each document that is the subject of a violation.
...Previous violation: not less than $2,000 and not more than $5,000 for each document that is the subject of a violation.


US Laws Declare it is Illegal To Aid or Abet Illegal Immigrants
. It is unlawful for anyone to aid or assist aliens to enter the United States. Penalty: fined under title 18, United States Code, or imprisoned not more than 10 years, or both. ( Sec. 277. [8 U.S.C. 1327] )


LEGAL Immigrants Must Know English, US History, US Laws, and Principles
. No person shall be naturalized as a citizen of the United States who cannot demonstrate: ... An understanding of the English language, including the ability to read, write and and speak words in ordinary usage in the English language.
... A knowledge and understanding of history, and of the principles and form of government, of the United States. ( Sec. 312. [8 U.S.C. 1423] )


Legal Immigrants Must Display Moral Character and No Crime Record
. Requirements as to residence, good moral character, attachment to the principles of the constitution, and favorable disposition to the Untied States. ( Sec. 316. [8 U.S.C. 1427] )


Legal Immigrants Must Be Investigated and Screened for past crimes and terrorism links
. Prior to a person becoming naturalized, or an employee of the service, a personal investigation is required of the individual applying.
( Sec. 335. [8 U.S.C. 1446] )


It is Illegal For Illegal Aliens to Bypass Medical and Physical Exams for illnesses and infectious diseases
. Physical and Mental Examinations are required.
Aliens arriving at ports of the United States will be detained for the purpose of determining whether they are afflicted with any of the diseases or mental or physical defects or disabilities set forth in section 212(a), or whenever the Attorney General has received information showing that any aliens are coming from a country or have embarked at a place where any of such diseases are prevalent or epidemic.
( Sec. 232 [8 U.S.C. 1252] )


Illegal Aliens Deported are ineligible for readmission to US Under Current Laws
. Distressed Aliens:
Any alien who falls into distress or who needs public aid from causes arising prior to his/her entry is desirous of being so removed. Any alien so removed shall be ineligible to apply for or receive a visa or other documentation for readmission, or to apply for admission to the United States except with the prior approval of the Attorney General.
( Sec. 250. [8 U.S.C. 1260] )


It is Illegal for Illegal Immigrants to possess a firearm or ammunition
. It is unlawful for an alien illegally in the United States or an alien admitted to the United States under a non immigrant visa to legally receive or possess firearms and/or ammunition. ( [18 U.S.C. 922(g) and (n), 27 CFR 478.32] )

The official legal language found in the US law codes and provisions for a person who unlawfully enters the US or overstays their visa is illegal alien.

Undocumented workers is a political term or slogan crafted by biased members of the media, illegal aliens and amnesty supporting groups.

Illegal aliens are not undocumented, they have plenty of documents because most engage in document fraud and identity theft to conduct their crimes in America.

The term illegal aliens is not meant in a disparaging or dehumanizing way. The definition and use of the term "illegal" is completely appropriate, since it is illegal for a person to enter or remain in the US without permission, as it is illegal for them to hold a job. Webster's dictionary defines the word alien as "belonging or relating to another person, place, or thing" and "relating, belonging, or owing allegiance to another country or government".

Illegal aliens owe their allegiance to other countries and they are both related to and belonging to other nations and governments!

Illegal alien and amnesty supporters politically oppose the term "illegal alien" because they think the American public will respond more negatively to the official definition for illegal immigrants.

Illegal immigration supporters feel that the term "undocumented workers" sounds more friendly and less destructive than illegal alien.

America is a nation of laws and the Rule of Law means that everyone receives justice regardless of status. For illegal aliens to receive justice by American standards, they are required to be repatriated to their home nations or return on their own accord.

Biased reporters and illegal alien supporters often engage in anti-immigrant and racist behaviors by trying to mischaracterize illegal aliens as migrants, immigrants, Hispanics or Latinos. It is highly anti-immigrant to compare law abiding and due paying legal immigrants with illegal aliens. It is equally racist to try to mislabel illegal aliens as Latinos or Hispanics.

Can you imagine the national uproar, if someone tried to mischaracterize shop lifters or prostitutes as black Americans?

We advise everyone to be on the lookout for the rampant political propaganda masquerading as news, that reports illegal aliens inappropriately as undocumented workers.

cinesimonj
cinesimonj

@john04301 But that's not what happened. You clearly have never bothered to actually look at the case - or if you have, you're so insecure you can't be honest about it.

You know you're being dishonest  Your insecurity is all too obvious, kiddo.

Try honesty for one - you'll find it to be satisfying.

cinesimonj
cinesimonj

@biggs-wedge2 @MotherJones

Yes let's spend loads of money on incarceration and transportation for deportation - because then childish twits like you can feel good.

biggs-wedge2
biggs-wedge2

@MotherJones @biggs-wedge2That's the biggest problem I have with this entire issue. If the government wants to spend money on other things than rooting out illegal immigrants, fine, depending on where that money is going. But, when the government has an illegal immigrant in custody and lets them go...that drive me insane.

john04301
john04301

mother jones thats just plain bull shit and you know it what was allowed  is it was  ok for anyone  to solicite work from the street . and it wasnt the surpreme court it was the 9th circut court

Trytolie
Trytolie

@john04301 No.  Sorry, you do not know the law.  Here, the worker had a TIN and had every expectation that his TIN was all that was needed to work.  These 'crimes' of which you complain are specific intent crimes, and the facts as revealed in the body of the case show no intent, specific or otherwise, to break the law.


Seriously, read the law, not some LYING jackass who edits it to make it fit his argument.  Don't trust me, don't truse Beck, read for yourself - and from the actual source, not some LYING presentation.

MotherJones
MotherJones

@john04301 It's a federal crime. When the U.S. Supreme Court ruled on 1070, it struck down the portion making it a crime to work without authorization. The state of AZ  cannot prosecute people for working w/out authorization. Therefore, Montgomery is breaking the law.

danzigsdaddy
danzigsdaddy topcommenter

@john04301  actually we are exercising 2 different sets of rules. when kids are caught using fake ID to buy alcohol its written off as youthful indiscretion even though they could have been using that ID for other stuff and been using it for god knows how long. the kids are let off with a slight fine or a stern talking too (and are easily bonded out if they do get arrested) they are still missrepresnting themselves and by the MCAO definition should not be bondable. i have no problem with the law being harsh on illegal immigrants, just so long as its a law that applies to everyone. i also expect cops to be held to certain standards just the same as us. MCAO isnt going after the employers who are hiring the illegals either and they are just as guilty. all laws should apply to all of us equally

Trytolie
Trytolie

@TryTryTryAgain Nice lies. but not on point.  YOU wrote illegal alien, it is not in the law you pretend to cite.

Moreover, just as there are any number of felonies a person whom is speeding may commit (DUI, evading arrest, kidnapping, murder, etc) that does not mean that speeding, alone, is not simply a CIVIL wrong.

So, too, just because an undocumented alien has the potential to commit a felony does not evitiate my point: being an unauthorized or undocumented alien is just a CIVIL violation, much like speeding.

We should enforce those CIVIL laws, but lets not lie to ourselves and in so doing make demons and scapegoats of these people.  Mature argument requires mature word choice (and a lot less deception than you seem to be capable of.)

Trytolie
Trytolie

@biggs-wedge2 @Trytolie @TryTryTryAgain You missed the point.

Not every alien here is "unlawful" and virtually none are "illegal."  That is a legal determination, and if you knew anything about the law you would know that these "crimes" are actually hard to convict on - because that is how WE THE PEOPLE wrote out immigration laws,

When LIARS label all aliens as "illegal aliens," they are trying to make it sound like there is a large universe of felons roaming our streets.  Your simple research should have made you realize that is a lie.

The vast majority of those we deport are done so using CIVIL laws - and I'm damn happy to see them go.  If they here in violation of our CIVIL laws, they need to go.

What we don't need is fear-mongering and scapegoating.  Anytime you hear or see someone using the illegitimate phrase "illegal alien."

NB: most newspapers no longer use that phrase because of its abuse of the truth and the English language. 

john04301
john04301

if a company uses e-verify on all their new potential employee's the feds and the states have no reason to charge the company with knowingley hiring illegal immigrants. arizona is one of those states that has been requiring companies to use e0verify since 2010. problems seem to arise from the employess who were hired before that.either way federal law states its against their law to hire a person without legal authorization .

biggs-wedge2
biggs-wedge2

@Trytolie @TryTryTryAgain I just pulled up the first two points that TryTryTryAgain posted, and although "illegal alien" is not written, the whole act is for "Unlawful" "aliens". I believe any thesaurus would list "illegal" under "unlawful", so there is your "illegal alien" 

http://thesaurus.com/browse/unlawful?s=t

These are 2 issues though. One, can we prosecute illegal aliens. Two, should illegal aliens be sent home.

I am no lawyer, so I will not argue the first question.

I do know that when you do something unlawful/illegal like enter a country without permission, you should not be allowed to stay. In a world of borders and laws, this must be followed.

If you would like to make the world one large country, go for it.

Trytolie
Trytolie

@TryTryTryAgain YOU LIE.  The code does not use the phrase illegal alien. You added that to make it look like you were defeating my declaration.


Of course we have immigration laws - and the of all the law you list, you don't hit on the false claim most people have, that simply being an unauthorized or undocumented alien that they are a criminal.


TRY TRY TRY TRY TRY AGAIN YOU LYING SOB

MotherJones
MotherJones

@TryTryTryAgain The laws you cite are federal laws. The feds have jurisdiction. And the feds have stopped workplace raids in favor of audits of companies, who fire any workers who are not working legally. In fact an I-9 form cannot be used to prosecute in state court because of this. Nor any attached docs. These state prosecutions are bogus. Montgomery knows it.

biggs-wedge2
biggs-wedge2

Correct, we were legal immigrants. That's the difference. Get them out of jail, and send them home.

david_saint01
david_saint01 topcommenter

@TryTryTryAgain by the way, "Illegal aliens owe their allegiance to other countries and they are both related to and belonging to other nations and governments!"..thats bullshit. We are a nation of immigrants, meaning at one point unless you are an American Indian even your ancestors fit this description.. 

david_saint01
david_saint01 topcommenter

@TryTryTryAgain i hate to break it to you, but what you support is AGAINST the Constitution. See, in very clear language, it states that "any person within our borders are afforded the same civil rights as any citizen"..meaning, you dont get to treat them like shit just because they are undocumented. But you people never want to concede this while you speak of the Constitution. So forgive me if i laugh at your comment, and call bs. 

 
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